I really, really want to know what the fuck is wrong with those "how DARE you not recognize that my child is holy and special and you should arrange the entire world so as to not inconvenience me or it" people. I'm honestly baffled at their inability to recognize that, hey, you know what, some people don't WANT to be around rude, ill-mannered children.

You weren't being a dick, he was, in other words. Especially with his jump to semi-accusing you of racism because you'd like to eat out without having to worry about parents refusing to discipline their children.

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That bizarre analogy he drew (it was an analogy, wasn't it? I'm half asleep) is pretty offensive, I'd say. Yeah, not wanting kids around sometimes in certain places is totally the same as institutionalized racism. And then somebody said he had a great comeback.

Also, his comment further down to the main post was in agreement with the idea that kids shouldn't be at work. Maybe black people shouldn't be at work either!!!!!

*goes back to sleep*

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Also, his comment further down to the main post was in agreement with the idea that kids shouldn't be at work. Maybe black people shouldn't be at work either!!!!!

God, I wanted to make that comment so much, but I really do try to not to perpetuate unpleasantness in other people's blogs - at least no more than necessary to try to help stupid people by pointing out the depths of their stupidity.

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Or in movie theaters!!!!

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I think I could have clarified my position a bit better and avoided the trigger word "childfree", but yeah, he went into Krazy Mode right away. Way to convince me you're comfortable with your decision to be a parent!

And, I mean, honestly, even well-behaved children (especially infants) can be intrusive on an evening between adults. What's so anti-child about just suggesting that adults should have the option to be in an all-adult environment, especially for anniversaries and other special occasions?

What really gets me is the guy who thinks it's offensive anytime anyone around him in a public space talks about sex. There's just no reasoning with that kind of self-righteousness.

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I think he was being a dick, but at the same time I think you probably shouldn't have used the word "childfree" considering its possible (and rather obvious) Internet-crazy connotations.

Seriously, this whole argument seems to be hinging on your use of the word "childfree" or not.

Edited at 2008-05-09 09:08 pm (UTC)

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I'm not going to stop calling myself an atheist because the people in atheism are a bunch of loons.

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I tried telling people that the crazy, bigoted creeps in that movement are more or less exclusive to cf_hardcore, but I don't think anyone is actually listening at this point.

(Speaking of which, do you ever read atheist_snark?)

Edited at 2008-05-09 09:57 pm (UTC)

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Yeah, I'm a founding member. I think. (I may be confusing it with dot_class_snark.)

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I should join dot_class_snark if I haven't already. (And try again with dot_race_snark, tho a fat lot of good petitioning the mods will do me since all of that... I don't even remember what, exactly.)

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I know. Most of the people I've encountered who use "childfree" only employ it as a lifestyle indicator.

And, honestly, being around children does make me uncomfortable. It doesn't mean I hate kids or that I want them regulated off in a corner like whatshisname apparently thinks.

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I know, and I should have clarified things, but I still think I'd have people jumping down my throat (especially the guy who apparently thinks adults who dare to talk about *gasp* sex around him are mean and evil. I guess in his world I can't talk about my real line of work!).

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Dude, I opened up my email and was scared by the number of emails. I thought:

1. jameth saw I made a joke about him and had his minions punk my journal.

2. Someone decided my BBC joke made me the next Ferret.

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Nope, I'm the troublemaker. I should have known too. The Internet crazies always come after me on days when I'm troubled by, you know, important things.

But, yeah, I should have just replied, "No, I'm wrong to suggest that adults might want a place where they can be free from even well-behaved but noisy children. And your analogy isn't offensive or degrading to black people at all!" Who knows, he probably would have taken it as sincere.

And not to bash the people who read your journal overmuch but...I did refrain from being sarcastic to the guy who said, "No, I don't want people to talk about sex in public around me!", which I consider a victory of restraint on my part.

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I was rather "impressed" that he didn't seem to realize the implications of comparing black people to children. It's a lot like that with Frivvy and other vegans comparing cattle to Jews... they are, by extension, comparing Jews to cattle, and isn't that a little, I don't know, racist?

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And did you read his follow-up comment? When he described my post AND IT DIDN'T EVEN BEGIN TO REFLECT THE REALITY OF WHAT I SAID? As much as I love having the last word, I had to surrender.

The sad thing is that the guy really does have kids. For their sake I hope to God his online self doesn't begin to resemble his real-life self, or else he's the male answer to Joan Crawford in "Mommie Dearest."

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Not to start a ridiculous side-debate in the middle of the one that's already being discussed, but I actually think there's an argument that comparing the mass slaughter of cattle with the Holocaust (if this is what you're referring to) is not racist. It's just a way of saying that cattle suffer physical pain in the same way as humans do.

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You're calling Jews cattle. How is that not racist?

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Please show me where anyone called Jews cattle.

Also, Jews were not the only people who were targeted in the Holocaust.

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Commutatively, to compare cattle to Holocaust victims is to compare Holocaust victims - Jews, homosexuals, gypsies and others - to cattle.

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People who don't like the Holocaust comparison like to make that point, but what I'm saying is that there is another way to see it, and I think it's an important difference. People who speak out on behalf of animal rights are not viewing the humans as if they are cattle, they are viewing that cattle as if they are humans. Because of the huge mix of people who were victims of the Holocaust, it's clear that the animals are being compared to humans, not Jews. And since the animals feel just as much physical pain as a human does, I can't say it's inappropriate.

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You really think that comparing humans to any kind of non-cognitive being, such as cattle, isn't demeaning? You don't think that you're suggesting that humans are non-cognitive?

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No, I don't. Not in the slightest.

But I guess we've gotten past the point of the race issue, so I'm done.

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Damn, screwed that up.

Sadly, this isn't even the weirdest, most irrational argument I've been in online. The winner is still when I got called homophobic and anti-Semitic for pointing out that Israel doesn't have a perfect gay rights record.

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You seem to have a chronic case of LJ drama.

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And it's really boring drama, too.

Still, it doesn't match the "best" LJ drama/screaming match I got into: an argument over National Writing Month. The best part was someone who kept insisting that people who publish books have no expertise to offer about writing because being a writer isn't the same as being a doctor or a lawyer, or something.

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My stance on anything both idiotic and mundane is -- rather than rally against it -- to simply neither consume nor pursue it.

I leave winning hearts and changing minds to other people.

Sniffing out of the truffles of life is taxing enough without sullying myself along the way with the truly inconsequential, no matter how initially tempting "argument for argument's sake" may be.

But that's just my personal approach; I by no means wish to pontificate on the matter.

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This is amusing. Maybe that guy should look into childfree movie theatres.

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So on top of being self-righteous, entitled, a liar, and the sort of person who projects all over the place (I mean, the whole "YOU'RE AS BAD AS A RACIST! Why are you throwing around all these unnecessary insults?!" thing was hilarious), he's also a hypocrite?

I am totally shocked.

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People who are prone to projection are generally hypocrites anyway. It's kind of the nature of projection.

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